The Truth About Mediumship Most People Get Wrong (In Their Development) — With Charlie Kelly

In this episode of Soul Sync, I sit down with Charlie Kelly for a grounded, honest conversation about what mediumship really is — beyond the assumptions, the expectations, and the misconceptions that often surround it.

This isn’t about performance.
 It’s not about “getting it right.”

It’s about understanding the subtle, natural connection that exists between us and the spirit world — and why so many people unknowingly make it harder than it needs to be.

We explore what actually happens when a medium connects, why overthinking can block the process, and how developing awareness — rather than forcing ability — is where everything begins to shift.

Because the truth is…

Most people aren’t disconnected from spirit.

They’re just trying too hard to hear it.

What you’ll hear

•  What mediumship really is (and what it isn’t) 
•  The biggest misconception that holds people back 
•  Why trying harder actually blocks the connection 
•  What it feels like when a genuine connection happens 
•  The role of awareness vs effort in mediumship 
•  How subtle the spirit world actually communicates 
•  Why simplicity is often the missing piece 

Who this episode is for

•  Anyone curious about mediumship but unsure what’s real 
•  People trying to develop their connection but feeling stuck 
•  Those who feel something is there… but can’t quite access it 
•  Listeners who want a more grounded, honest understanding of spirit 

Mentions & ideas

•  Awareness vs effort in spiritual development 
•  Letting go of expectation 
•  The difference between thinking and sensing 
•  Building trust in subtle experiences 

Gentle note

This episode explores spiritual concepts and personal experiences.
Take what resonates, leave what doesn’t, and trust your own journey.

 ✨ Get in touch

If this episode resonates, follow Soul Sync and share it with someone who’s been exploring their connection.

 If you have a story, experience, or idea you'd love to share on Soul Sync, I’d love to hear from you.
📩 Email: hello@jasonpaulmedium.com 🌐 Website: jasonpaulmedium.com

Transcript

Introduction (Music)

Charlie Kelly Medium 0:10

Hello, it's Jason Paul. You're here in the SoulSync podcast. Now, I record this episode the day after I've just done my first ever platform uh bit of mediumship, which is what I really feel my calling is. I feel my soul is pulling me towards uh platform mediumship, and it's something that I've been working on now. Well, since this podcast ever began, quite frankly, and it's kind of been everything, all the twists and turns of the whole um SoulSync podcast, you could even say, has been building up to this one point. Talk about uh putting the weight of all the pressure on that moment, but it's actually been a god now as that was yesterday, and it was really beautiful. I did two contacts and um I brought through lots of evidence. And in this conversation today, um, myself and my next guest talk about that and we talk about the journey of mediumship and um you know what you go through um when you decide that you're on this path of wanting to unfold um and develop um your connection with the spirit world. And Charlie, um, well, let me tell you this anyway. His name is Charlie Kelly, he's um very well known for his mediumship, and I first came across Charlie on YouTube uh because he is very straight talking and he has a lot of videos uh that talk about how he's how he developed his mediumship and how um as he sees it to develop your mediumship, and we talk about that today. Now, in this conversation, I honestly was writing down so many notes and Charlie just um you know cuts away all the rubbish and nonsense and keeps mediumship very simple. So we talked about um how Charlie has learned to get out the way and where I feel I am with getting out the way because when you're developing um your connection with the spirit world, really it's as Charlie, as Charlie explains at this episode, it anyway, it's as easy as flicking on um, you know, the kettle. It's you don't it's not something you have to build or something you have to work on or something where you have to keep um going through some sort of ritual. It is literally as easy as flicking on a switch, and we talk about how we overcomplicate the process. So it's a very reflective conversation this one on two people who've been treading their own paths um in mediumship, and it's full of um a lot of laughs along the way. So this is my um conversation with the beautiful medium Charlie Kelly. I know I say this a lot, but especially so this time. Charlie Kelly, welcome back to the SoulSync. Thanks for having me. It's an absolute delight, and it's lovely to have you back because it feels like it's been a long time, but not at the same time. But maybe I'm kind of measuring that against my own mediumship development. I don't know, or working in dog years. But you know, last time you came on, I think I was at a place in my own development where I probably had more questions than answers, and in some ways I still feel like I've got that. But I had an interesting moment last night because I did my first bit of platform mediumship, so it was like, oh, Charlie, it was it was on the it was terrifying, and I've been on edge. I could not have been in a more spiritual place all weekends because I've been on the edge of my seat. And I went into it, it was on Zoom, and I was the last person to to read, and it made me really aware of my own mediumship. First contact, very strong, I kind of felt it, but the second contact could have been a bit better. I moved out the energy, got lost a bit in the audience, sitters, yeah, and then and then I couldn't whittle the hands down enough, and I just kept getting three hands. And by this point, Charlie, I'd said, right, I've got a woman who's given me a unique story where she's essentially used her handbag as a weapon and beaten someone with it. And I've still had three people with their hands up, yeah, yeah. So it was and well, do you know what? And afterwards, what when I was sat there, I was thinking to myself, beating myself up a bit, or I could have done better in the second contact. And the next morning I wake up and the woman said it's the most meaningful reading she's ever had.

Charlie’s Journey Into Mediumship

Jason Paul 4:25

It's that'll always happen as well. You just gotta get used to it, you just gotta get used to it. I I think you'll do that a lot. I think what you'll think is good, the client will go, yeah, it was alright. And what you it happens a lot for me. Yeah, what you think's rubbish, they're like life changing, you saved my life. So yeah, it's just I I think our measure it is very uh negative set, so we're always looking for flaw or mistake, and where could it have gone better? And we do very quickly brush off the good bits that we do because uh but it we're striving for perfection. Mediums tend to tend to have the trait of the perfectionist, the controlling aspect of it, and so they're looking for this perfection that they'll never achieve.

Charlie Kelly Medium 5:12

And and how did you learn to move past how did yeah, how do you ever do you still feel that now?

Jason Paul 5:18

Yeah, I just don't think it will go away. I th I think that's the flame though. I think that's the flame inside you that keeps you going because it's like you you hit plateaus and you feel like you're not moving, then the flame ignites again and you move forward. But I I think not and you just can't perfect it because what they want is their let's say their m they they want the conversation with their which you can give them, uh you can give them some form of essence which you can kind of give them, but they they miss the physical touch, the physical vision, which you can't give them. And so all you can do is get as close as you possibly can to do that, and they'll always want more. You could sit for three hours and they would want four. You know, you sit for 30 minutes, they want an hour. So I think I got comfortable with the idea of I know I can't get perfection, no one's ever got perfection, but I'm out here trying. And I I think that's the bit where you where it I I can kind of because the critique's so heavy, isn't it? It's uh it's like you have a if you have a really bad one, you're you're you're stockpiling bell and cherries, aren't you? And you're you're having a duvet feeling good afterwards, yeah. Feeling exactly, and it's duvet day, the curtains are shut, and you're watching rubbish TV because you are down, and and it's just one of those. I think we are so so imbalanced in in the critique, the self-sabotage of self. So so you'll do a 96% good reading, and your focus will be the 4% that you messed up. At no point do you offset it and go, Well, I did something half decent, so I can work on that, but I did something half decent where just like I messed it up, I've ruined it, I'm a failure, I need to give up. You know, so it's like that.

Charlie Kelly Medium 7:14

It really do you know the thing is, I I don't look at being a medium as something I want to do. I feel like it's something I have to do, I feel like it's a calling I have within me. Well, I'm not at a point where I I I'm excited to work for for the sp the spirit and to be a channel, but I'm not seeking out readings because I I I only think to myself, I don't think I could do more than four in a week at the moment because it's the the build-up stress.

Jason Paul 7:48

Yeah, yeah, it kills you to build up, yeah, the anxiety that goes with it. Yeah, I understand what you're saying now. I've I feel I feel if if I express it slightly differently, is that you you stumble across something so life-changing. Like I'm I I I don't even recognise myself from five years ago, let alone 10 years ago, and it mind blowing at 15 years ago. I have changed as an individual, and that's because of the spirit world that I found along the way. And it almost feels a little bit selfish not to go, have you do you know about this? Have you seen this? This changes your life. And I think that's that calling inside is like you need to show people this is here, um, and it's that that's my motivation. It's it's like do you remember at school when we were kids and you'd go in and you'd have that day where it's like show and tell, and you bring in your it's kind of like a grown-up show and tell for me. It's like, oh my god, there's a man.

Charlie Kelly Medium 8:44

I can see that. I can see that because a lot of the reasons I'm developing mine is for that very reason because I came to mediumship because my yes, my granddad was a medium, I can't get away from that fact. That was what drew me in, but it drew me in from the perspective that I felt bloody miserable in my life because I just couldn't understand what is the point of birth and death. And I felt look, everyone around me was saying, You are successful. I don't bloody feel like it. Yeah, yeah. So that was what sort of brought me into it. And how would you say it's changed you in that time? I know you probably too long to even sit here and talk about, but I'm interested to know how it's changed you.

What Most People Get Wrong About Mediumship

Jason Paul 9:24

Because I just my my upbringing was one that was kind of self-sufficient, you know. I had alcoholic parents, and but like I don't complain or moan about them in in any sense. It gave me a streetwise attitude. I had to look after my kind self, you know. But the people I was surrounded with weren't the would not not a spiritual bone in their body, you know, it was counselor state, it was rough times, and so trusting anyone. I was well into my late, late 20s, maybe early 30s, before I realised that there are some nice people here. And so, and so then I get into the spiritual community, and naively you go into the spiritual community, everything's love and light now. Now you're trusting people you shouldn't be trusting, and so you get your fingers burnt um for for like uh on another time, and then you whittle it all down, and like my my judge of character now, I don't react to situations the way I did before. It's not a personal attack, it's just you don't know the day they're having or what their story's about, and I'm not reacting from an ego standpoint or an aggressive standpoint, and and but but I remember the time when I would react from an ego standpoint or an aggressive, what are they after? What do they want? Why are they being nice? Why are they being kind? They're after something. So it's and now I'm not like that at all. So it's it's it's a massive change for me.

Charlie Kelly Medium 10:50

It's interesting what you say about spirituality and it not being all good. You kind of go, I I remember going through that phase when you're saying this, it's almost like, yep, okay, I've been there. Yeah, okay, I can recognise that. We can. But isn't it interesting? Because I've started thinking, and I had this a trailer thought recently where I felt to myself, why did I not discover the spirit world earlier and believe in it earlier? If I'd known it, the potential of you know the fact I'm a limitless being at 18, you know, I'd be further ahead. But I thought it came to me and I thought, no, that's because you had to learn the hard listens along the way, you had to experience what you experience. Yeah, and I very much feel that's like you, Charlie.

Jason Paul 11:31

Yeah, well, I I the way I describe that is that I I was I was running wild, mate, at 18. Oh my god, I was fucking wild.

Charlie Kelly Medium 11:38

I could almost I feel it in you, yeah.

Jason Paul 11:40

I can imagine. I was running wild, and I I had no reason to look for for for a god. I had no reason to. And then and then tragedy hit that hit the family, and then the question was asked, and it kind of marinated over like a decade, and it just got worse. That the that you know, what is that? What why are we here? Where do they go? What happens? Um, and it just chewed me up, and so I was like, nah, I'm gonna look into it. And and and then I looked into it. So so I I think I think I didn't need a God at that point. My life changed enough that made me ask the question of a god, whatever whatever terminology you need, uh I'm gonna use God.

Charlie Kelly Medium 12:23

Well, it's similar to even what I'm it's making me feel about my granddad. Why did I not ask him about his mediumship or any questions whatsoever about the spirit world, really? Because I wasn't bothered by death then, and it the first time I had grief was when he died, and then I hadn't asked him any of the questions. So I can't feel late.

Jason Paul 12:41

Well, it was almost like mortal at 18 though, don't you? You feel like nothing can help you. So now I I cough and I put my back out. Do you know what I mean? It's like, Jesus Christ, I'm not immortal anymore.

Charlie Kelly Medium 12:53

You're not well, you start realising when you get to a a certain age, and I think you know that's that's very much how I kind of feel about it as well. I kind of got drawn in. Why is it so you've been doing this now for a you know a very long time? Um 17 years now. Well, you'll start to be to be getting to the point where it's over half your life soon, if you know, at that point. Yeah, yeah. What what do you find that you're still developing at the moment? Because you never stop developing, do you?

The Difference Between Real Connection & Imagination

Jason Paul 13:22

It's just an ongoing thing. I don't think you do. I don't think you stop developing at all. I I I again I think I'm always striving for the perfection. So I I'm I'm someone that that I'm a I'm an advocate for the intelligence of the spirit world. And and if you know, like if your granddad's coming through to have a communication, I want to get beyond like the size of his shoes or you know, whatever. I want to go straight into the nuts and bolts. So your granddad wants me to say blah. And you know, in those opening sentences, like, oh my god, that is definitely him. So it's I I refer to that as layering, so so it's a it's information, communication, layer, layer, layer, which would offer the depth, the depth, the depth, the nuts and bolts, bang, gotcha. Now we can get on with it. That's I thought I've been developing that for a while now. So and when you say layering, what does that look like? Layering looks like because a lot of media mediums, I don't want to offend anyone, but mediums love the sound of their own voice. Oh, you won't offend anyone here, Charlie. I can assure you that. But they love the sound of their own voice, they don't shut up, and so there's no validation. So, and then what I mean is you could you could say to you could say to someone, so I've got an old lady that wants to come step forward as I connect to the spirit world, whatever the terminology is nowadays, and and she's showing me collecting truffles in the garden with her pig. She dresses this pig up and she loves her pig, and you'd understand that your nan smokes, and then they get validation there, and so the client says, Yes, my nan smokes, but the audience believes that she's got this pig that's getting truffles in the garden, and so layering is validation every step of the way. So I've got a man, this, this, this, and this. You understand this man, yes, and then from that point onwards, everything is validated, which is a layer upon a layer. So it should, if if, if done correctly, and I'm surrendering my mind enough, they should give me enough of a block for like six, seven, eight statements that tells its own story. Now, I what I mean by that is I don't need to know the story, I don't need to understand the story, I don't even need to know how and when they go together. The client knows that information, but they will say yes all the way through. So it'll be yes, yes, yes. So layer, layer, layer, layer. And just through through certainly the last five years, I can't get away from it. They're waiting at the car. And they're like, I just want to tell ya, and then they're telling me about what was said, and and they they just want to share the story and they're excited, they're they're pleased their mum, their dad, or whatever turned up. But every time they do that, I see how the spirit world operated, and and I'm grateful that I could suppress myself to not judge it, work it out, understand it, which took a little bit of learning because I was told the other one.

Charlie Kelly Medium 16:29

Well, do you know what? I've never heard anyone describe it like that. How would I describe my mediumship at the moment? I'd love to be having layer upon layer upon layer of green lights and yeses. I'm certainly not getting layers upon layer. Maybe I'm necessarily done big heart on myself, aren't I? But how do I even explain what goes on? Because it's also personal, isn't it? When a spirit person comes through for me at the moment, I sort of feel it. I can I I know things and I feel like they just keep giving me images, but it's it really obscure images where at first I was taking them as face value. Whereas last night I did a reading, and on do you ever watch Coronation Street? No. Oh, okay. There's a character from 20 years ago that they imprinted in my mind, but I knew not to read it too literally. But I feel like my mediumship at the moment, Charlie, is just like bloody chaos at times, you know. I'm sort of getting bits and pieces of all sorts.

Jason Paul 17:22

I I think I think I think growing in the comfort of the chaos, in the clunky, in the messy, I think growing comfortable there is a really good thing. So I I know you from a podcast, and I I can kind of maybe work out. You're into a literature, you've got a little fish tank going on there, you got the audio. So so I'm starting to build context of who you are, but only by a very limited surrounding that I can see you. So you'll you'll flip them headphones off, you'll turn the mic off, you'll leave your little room, and you'll go about your evening. And I don't know what that consists of. I lack context. Now, now I'm working with a man that wants to talk to you, and I have zero context. Not I know nothing about them. I know nothing about you. And what mediums are trying to do is they're trying to control the situation in understanding what this man wants to say to you, even though they don't know him, and give it to you in a way that's going to be heard that the medium understands the statement that they're giving, but without the context of you. And so they're trying to control two points in a three-point triangle where they have zero context. And so that what mediums are doing is they're saying the statement through the lens of life that I have experienced. So I am saying the statement that I'm comfortable saying because I get it, I understand it, I know where you're going with it through my my story, which is not your story. We we'll have similar school journeys or bits, but we other than that, we have we're probably very little in common. So the context of or the judgment of the value of the statement that I'm receiving to give to you is a mile off. I don't get it. So you may be an emotional individual, and so then the information's coming through where I don't really like emotion.

Charlie Kelly Medium 19:22

I am very emotional as a medium, I'm always getting the emotion of it first.

Jason Paul 19:26

So so so I'm gonna I'm gonna be like, whoa, emotion, back off.

Charlie Kelly Medium 19:32

I can't say I'm pleased about it, Charlie, but that's the way it's happening for me.

Jason Paul 19:37

You embrace it. Whereas you're embraced. Well, I do, yes. I do I do, yes. So so so where it's so so different. And so I just got comfortable with without it sounding really, really cold, is not caring. I don't care what this guy wants to say to you. I don't care. What I care about is being an ambassador and being the cleanest and purest voice that I can be for this man. And for me to do that, I can't judge it. I I have no context, so I can't vet it. And so all I can do is give it in its simplistic of form, and the when I do that, when I'm able to keep myself out of it, the whole way through you'll be going, yep, yep, yep.

Charlie Kelly Medium 20:21

And you you say something very interesting there, keeping oneself out the way.

Jason Paul 20:27

Well, it's like you go to Starbucks. I don't is the community alright? Like, is it have you got like a variety of community?

Charlie Kelly Medium 20:34

Like, are they Oh we've got all sorts on here, Charlie. We're a right old assemble.

How Mediumship Actually Feels (From the Inside)

Jason Paul 20:38

Yeah, okay. So you you go, you go, you're in a bit of a rush, and you go into Starbucks. There are other coffee shops available, so don't sort of hate me in the comments. It's just a globally recognised one. You go in and you ask for your your latte or or whatever, and you can see the the young lad or the young woman the other side is getting it ready, but they're a little bit stroppy, they've had a bit of a rough life, and you don't care. I want my coffee, I've paid for my coffee. Hurry up with the coffee. Now they could be chatting or or whatever, and you're you're building in frustration and I'm in a rush, hurry up, give me my coffee, and then and then you get thirsty. But at no point have you considered, like, I wonder how their day is, I wonder how many people they've approached like me. Now, mediums haven't got that that awareness about themselves. They think they're important mediums. When when I pay I'm paying you for a reading with my mum, I don't give a shit if you've had a bad night. I don't care if you're in a you're having a bit of a rough ride. I don't give a shit what's going on in your life. I've paid you for a communication with my mum. And mediums have got this heavily diluted aspect of that I think like I care about you as a medium when I'm paying for communication with my mum. When the reality is you're irrelevant. You're just the voice. And you're the first one I saw on the internet. You're the first one in my my spiritual church, my local spiritual church. But what goes on in your life, I don't care, mate. I miss my mum. I want a conversation with my mum. And mediums have got a little bit wrapped up in that. And so we need to understand, like, they don't care. So I my job is to adjust accordingly to the person that's entered the room, whether I need to, whether I need a softer energy, whether I need a firmer energy to do the communication. But they don't care what I did like before the read, after the read. Last week, the night I've had, did I sleep well? Are you well nourished, mate? They're not thinking like that. They just like my I just want to hear from my mum. And so I that was a big turning point for me when I realized I am the main character in my movie. But I am barely an extra in yours. Barely. And so the value of that is I stopped being offended. Because in your movie, I'm an irritant, I'm an annoyance, I'm fun, I'm whatever. And then I leave. And then you're the main character, and the camera's following you around in your movie. In in the medium's mind, I'm relevant in my movie, your movie, their movie, the Spirit World's movie, and now everything's ever so personal. And I feel attacked, and I feel insignificant, and I feel like you all hate me. And I just they don't care. They don't care. Like I care about Jason today because I had to meet him at six o'clock to do a podcast. But after the podcast, I I've got another appointment with another individual, and then they'll become important.

Charlie Kelly Medium 23:58

You make it sound really easy, and you know, I guess that's the thing when you've been to make it for as long as you have, I can't imagine how many lessons you've had to learn along the way. You're right, yeah. Well, you make there's so many points to almost unravel there, you know. Yes, you know, the medium doesn't uh matter in this, it all that matters is the communication, and but there's so much ego that gets wrapped up in this.

Jason Paul 24:27

So that that's what that's like that we can springboard into another area there, you know, mediums developing and mediums doing. And I remember my own frustration and my own plateaus, and like, I'm not moving, I'm not growing, I'm not, I'm not doing anything. But but then I would turn up and I'd be like, right, I need to know who you are. Who are you to this individual? And how did you pass? And what's your job? And I want to know, and I want to understand, and I'm not getting it. And so then I sat down and I was like, Am I in service? Because that don't sound like fucking service, mate. That sounds like I'm a demanding, spoilt little brat, and I I want, I want, I want. And then when I don't get what I want, I have a hissy fit like I was when I was five years old in the aisle because mum won't let me have chocolate. And then I realize like service is just turning up, and this is what I have to do. I am the third point of a three-point triangle in value, and I've just got to do what they're asking me to do. They're asking me to talk about this. Whether I think it's boring, whether I think it's controversial, whether I think it's offensive, whether I think does not matter. The service is just do that. And I'm like, cool, I'll just do that. So that's like you entering my office space and saying, Jason, can you move that box from there to there for me, please? I'll go make C. And and what mediums are doing right now is they'll go, why? What's in the box? You're like, well, it don't matter what's in the box, I just need it moved to there. And you're like, Well, I'll only move the box if you tell me what's in the box. And then I tell you what's in the box just to get the box moved. And and then you go, why'd you do that? Why'd you buy that? What what have you got that for? And you're like, geez, Jason, I'll do it myself. I'll move the box myself. And that's kind of where I realised maybe I'm not doing this right. If I am in service, genuine service, I need to talk to people that maybe I wouldn't talk to in Starbucks, that maybe I wouldn't spend time with in the evening in my in my private life. But it's not about me. It's about your lovely mum, your lovely dad, your grandparents, your brother, your sister, your partner. It's about them, and they want me to talk to you. And the service, the ambassador that I am, I will make that, I will make that effort. And then I went.

Charlie Kelly Medium 26:57

Do you know what?

Jason Paul 26:57

It's already a beautiful, it's making me feel like that's where I want to be, because in that situation the pressure is off you in a sense, but you you you are just that channel, but it also eases on the self-critique because it what what happens there is I tried my best. I tried, I turned up, I tried my best. There's nothing else I can do. And what a lot of mediums, you yourself and and and your listeners, your subscribers, there will be so many episodes, and it's only hindsight with years and years behind me when the client has outrightly said no to me. You're that's not correct, that's not right. And the amount of text, phone calls, inboxes, DMs, emails where they go, I'm so sorry, you were right, I don't know why I said no. Is is unbelievable. But by then, the damage is done. I've gone home. Yes, I'm sad, I'm miserable, I'm I'm I'm like, I'm so sorry. I tried, I don't know what I'm getting wrong, and the self-sabotage kicks in, and you know, the damage is already done. Or it goes the other way. You start shouting at the team, you lot, what's going on up there? Why are you giving it like that? And only to find out it was actually correct and perfectly presented.

Charlie Kelly Medium 28:21

So what I find at the moment I'm at a stage in my mediumship, and I don't know if it's just the bra the way my brain works, but I get a bit of evidence, I even say there's evidence, something, and before I've even known it, Charlie, it's gone up to the brain. How the hell do you train yourself to stop doing that when in every other I don't care, yeah, I don't care.

Jason Paul 28:42

I use Carol as the example. I don't have you met Carol.

Charlie Kelly Medium 28:45

I've only ever had the privilege of s exchanging beautiful messages with her. Yeah, yeah, she's very, very good at admin shit.

The Role of the Mind vs Spirit Communication

Jason Paul 28:52

Oh, she's most wonderful. I love Carol. So every every now and again it's like she she's she's not into much really. She's uh in that sense, maybe that's why we get on. But she does like a bag. This one, she does like a bag. So I'll go away, and it'll be, I don't know, 18 months, and there'll be a new season out of the brand that she likes, whatever that brand is, you know. There'll be a new season, and then I'll be like, come on, you've worked hard this year. Let's let's go. Do you want a new bag? And she'll be like It's Charlie bonus season. Yeah, and then she'll go and she'll go and get it, and then she'll go in the shop, and and uh I'll want to stand outside and smoke a cigarette, mate. I just want to be left alone. I just want to take in the I couldn't care less about a bag, could not care less. You just want a quiet life, yeah. But I get dragged in there, and then I end up talking to a sales assistant, and then she'll find the blue one, the black one, the grey one, the pink one, whatever one it is, and then she'll be eyeing it up, and I already know she wants that one. That's the one that she wants. And she'll say to me, What do you think? And I say to her, I don't fucking care, it's your bag. I'm not gonna get to use it, I'm not gonna get to, it's it's not mine, it's nothing to do with me. And that's how I see communication. I just don't care. So providing I'm doing everything that mum wants me to get across, I don't care what it is, what you want to talk about, or whatever, I'm just your messenger. I just see myself as the spiritual Amazon prime driver. Here's your goods. Here they are. Now there is a bedside manner, I need to learn to deliver it with with uh a tone or with a certain amount of emotion, a certain amount of essence, but it I'm not invested Charlie into it in any way, shape, or form. It's not for me. So it would be great if if if your partner was to come in, one of your friend or whatever was to come in and there is a heated discussion right now on the podcast, I'd be here, but it's not my argument, it's not my it's not my debate. And so at the end of it, I'd be like, Are we good? Do you need time? Do you need whatever? But it's not mine. I'm not gonna ask you what it was about, it's clearly you two, up to you two, what it is, and I just disconnect in that way, it's not mine. Like Carol with a bag, it's not my bag. I'm never gonna use the bag. You may have a lovely car, mate. You may have a lovely car, but it's never gonna be my car, and so I don't care, and so it's that's the disconnect that I had that I have with that.

Charlie Kelly Medium 31:23

How did you get to this epiphany? I don't because it's a great. I'm gonna try it because it's I I got bringing yourself into it, and it's clever what you're doing there.

Jason Paul 31:34

Again, I'd but it's like you wouldn't want me involved in your argument, you wouldn't want me sitting in your car, you wouldn't want me uh in and so I just recognize that from the client's point of view value in the in the exchange of monetary or whatever whatever it is. And so early development, what you what you tend to find is that you overinvest, you overinvest emotionally, you overinvest in energy and time and hours and you know, all that kind of stuff. And you'd go home and that poor mum, that poor dad, that poor, that poor woman, that poor man, that poor child. What about that story? And so I weren't having any kind of life. I'd be sat in a room doing readings, on a stage doing Dems, in a class doing teachings, then going home and thinking that poor man, that poor woman. And so there was no Charlie left. It it's gone. And so I was like, I need I need a structure, I need something that allows me, because I love being an idiot, mate. If I'm ever in the company with you and you give me an opportunity to be an idiot, we'd bounce off of one another being an idiot.

Charlie Kelly Medium 32:41

I know you'd be just the sort of person that'd get me in a lot of trouble very quickly. Very quickly. I can be the class clown at times as well.

Jason Paul 32:50

But it's like that's why people love Jason, though. They do, and and Jason is fading away into his work, fading away into this subject, and we're losing him to this thing. And I was like, that's not the purpose to this. I need to be me, and then I need to put the uniform on of the ambassador, and then I'll I will use my disciplines, my mechanics, my training to become the individual they need me to be, and that is service.

Charlie Kelly Medium 33:21

That's where it does so many things at the same time. It takes the pressure, this you know, attitude, it takes the pressure off the expectation off the draining off because you know, people it's heavy work. This it's you know it's heavy.

Jason Paul 33:33

It can be really, really heavy. You tend to you'll what what will happen is if you haven't had it yet, you'll have themes. So you'll have you'll have basically you'll have a theme of mums, a theme of dads, a theme of like really difficult, a theme of like tragic, a theme of and you're like, my god, what a week this has been. And why do you think you get the themes? Because there's there's something in that. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. It's familiar. So if if you've got like a young man that likes to break the law in your energy, in in the spirit world, and I'm working with your energy, it's familiar to me. So I'm like, oh, there's a young guy that wants to have a word with you, but it's really normal for me. But you're into baking, you're into home life, you're into you know, structure, then you'll go get the people in my story in the spirit world that tick those boxes of familiar. So now what happens is I've just dealt with someone that that has an addiction, alcohol, drugs, whatever, and I do the read, and that Jason leaves, and the next client comes in, and my god, there's their uncle that was an alcoholic. That now they don't want to hear from their uncle. It's just that I was just working in the vice segment of awareness. Now the uncle's walked in, it's so obvious you've got an alcohol problem. Come in, and then he leaves, and then I've got someone's dad that was a little bit violent or abusive when he got drunk. And what do you know? He's available now. So we fall into patterns because it's familiar, it the energy is familiar, and you'll find that with demonstrations. If it goes like kind of up with fun and laughter, it can take a quick turn, it's doom and gloom, and now they're all doom and gloom, and the energy falls through the floor, but it's familiar, it's it's what you're basking in, it's that energy. So the importance of canvas cleaning within your mind, clean slate, and who's stepping forward now, and that's where the variety will kick in, and you you stop the theme. So you have to be aware of the the mood that you are or the energy that you've been basking in all day. You go and watch a stand-up show, comedy, and then and then you you you catch the lunchtime show in Leicester Square, and you've got a reading at five o'clock. I guarantee you, you'll get the funny guy in the spirit world. It makes sense though. The energy of it is familiar, is familiar, yeah.

Charlie Kelly Medium 36:02

You wonder everything is energy. I often wonder to myself, what is it like in the spirit world? They sort of put this intention out like a almost like a telephone book, right? I want somebody who's got that experience, that vocabulary, that you know, it's just crazy to think how it must work up there for them to even I think the biggest mistake when it comes to getting the the the individual for the right individual.

Why People Block Their Own Ability

Jason Paul 36:24

So when you enter the room, no, I I I I haven't really found the language to describe what it is that I'm talking about. But inside of me, in my heart, in my soul, in my mind, whatever you want to know, because I just don't know which one it is, but I am the guy that will help the the guy that is tires blown out on a back road. I'll help the woman with her shopping. I just want to help. Like I can see you struggling. Let me help. I've got the ability, let me help. When you enter the room, you enter the room, and I go to the place that I call the spirit world, and I just say, Who's doing this? And then then I'm aware of someone, and and the client always says, That's who I wanted. And what mediums are doing is they see you and then they go, Right, I've got to go and get someone, and then they go and pick someone, and they will pick what they're comfortable with. Now, what if you want to speak to someone that was not very nice? You want answers, and you want to speak to someone that weren't very nice, the medium won't find that one because that's all it totally logical on why someone would go to a medium for that reason. Exactly. And so, as you enter the room and I go to the place that I know, I don't care for you, you don't care for me. You want the person that I really want to be in service to. So my energy says, without an intention, without words, without it's my being. I really want to help you, and I'm in service to this place, the spirit world, who's doing it, then I'm aware of, and now, and 99 out of 100 readings don't go, that's who I wanted. I'm let's go with that.

Charlie Kelly Medium 38:05

I'm having a good run at the moment. I'm having all jovial, nice spirit people wanting to come through me. I think I'm having them once. They're lovely. They are. I'm I'm getting nice people at the moment, so I'm on a good run. Please let it make long may it continue. I think they're going easy on me, then I'm on the edge, Charlie. One one long platform appearance, and that's it, I'm out. So I'll see my biggest problem at the moment. Trying.

Jason Paul 38:29

Yeah, yeah. Well, it's that it's the biggest is the biggest problem in mediumship. If if I said to you, lift that leg of yours up and show the show the viewers how to tie a shoelace, you'll mess it up. We'll be here for a very long time, I tell you. This simplicity of bobo, wrap round, and pull tight, and through the trying to be perfect, it'll go wrong. And so mediums go into the read and they're trying step by step by step by step, and it's absolutely gonna go wrong. But but if I say tie your laces while talking to me about what you did yesterday, you'll do it subconsciously, and and it'll be a good bow, and it'll be absolutely fine. Now, what happens when mediums are thinking is you're above 13 Hertz in the mind. You are processing, which means you are disconnecting from a communicator because they're at 13 hertz. And so if you are thinking about mediumship, what most mediums aren't doing is reconnecting with the communicator. They think, so that raises the hertz, you're 15, 16, 17 Hertz in process, but you forget to get the communicator back. Where's that lady? And now the lady joins me, and now you'll be all right. But most mediums miss that step. They leave the communicators going to the process and think and forget to reconnect and get the information, and that's where it will go wrong. You're trying, and it's the trying that stops it.

Charlie Kelly Medium 39:58

Right. I'm going to prepare for a demonstration. Right. I'm going there. This is the routine. I'm gonna sit and I'm gonna try and up the energy a bit, you know, in whatever way possible. I'm going out out there, you know, trying not to think, how do I know if I'm in 13 hertz? You know, because all of a sudden I'm thinking again, I'm walking all the way. Am I standing on the you know, platform? Okay, I'm there.

Jason Paul 40:23

Yeah, I I think I think the appointment got slightly changed today, didn't it? It was like 5 30, and then you were like, No, I'm gonna rush, I need to get home at work or something like that, don't you? Yes. So, what what do you do as a job?

Charlie Kelly Medium 40:35

I recruit lawyers into law firms. So basically, I I know it's very stressful. It's very stressful, but my psychic skills have been built doing that.

Jason Paul 40:44

But and uh are you the boss or have you got a boss?

Charlie Kelly Medium 40:48

I well depends how you look at it. Yeah, yeah.

Jason Paul 40:51

So but there's a lot of better both, Charlie. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, so so now when when you go to work, it's not like on the way to work you go, right? I've got to get into work mode and I've got to be a nice man, I've got to recruit in the right way, and I've got to do the you you just you just go to work. This is my work. I just turn it now. When I when I used to work, and I would love my old bosses to see me now and to listen to the conversation because I would have to take a breath before I went into work because I'd be organising sites in London and you know, sending crews out to build that and fix that and do that. But I'd get to the gates of work and I'd have to take a breath and go, you need the job, Charlie. Don't tell him he's a dickhead today. You need the job. And so I'd go in and I'd have to bite my lip. Like he would he would make silly mistakes, or there'll be clerical errors, or he didn't book that van at the right time and things like that. And the whole time I had to bite my tongue, and then I'd be like, It's cool, let me fix it, and I'll phone the van company, I'll ring the site, and I'll fix it all, and everything would run smoothly. And that's what I have to do in mediumship. That that I work with some dickheads, I work with some people that are horrible, and I work with angelic people, they are beautiful human beings, or their story was that. And I've just got to bite my tongue sometimes, and I can't say the things that I want to say because I need the job. I need the job. I can't be, I can't so so suppression is normal. Turning up for work and getting into gear is normal. We all do it, whether it be as a medium or as someone that works on site or someone that's recruiting lawyers. You you go into work mode, you've got your structure, whether it be Monday or Friday, and you have your weekends off. Some people only work weekends, but they go into work gear straight away. As I cross the threshold of my office, as I cross the threshold of the the the platform, as I step onto my stage, I'm now at work and change, and that is it. Now I am no different. I'm outside, I'm smoking. If I could smoke two cigarettes at once, mate, I would. I am as nervous as you.

Charlie Kelly Medium 43:04

I can I say something on this point because what and this was something I wrote down early. You know, I'm sitting there trying, trying to do this, trying to do that, trying to build my energy, all these things that are putting me up in my mind more and more and more. You know, that ability, and this is something that you talk about a lot, which is just flicking the mind. Which I guess is what you know, I'm do I'm doing that, but I'm trying to do so many other things in the process.

Jason Paul 43:30

Yeah, yeah. But you'll do it now. If there was a knock at the door right now, you'd instantly switch off a podcaster mode and you'd go to Jason at home, doors gone, and you'd go, you're right, and like you'll have to you'd have to wait a minute. I'm on a podcaster, you'll walk back in and click straight away. Again, anything other than that is gonna end in disappointment. And I've just I've just been disappointed too many times that I recognise I've got a choice here. I can either sit up at one o'clock. In the morning, beating myself up about it, or don't let it happen. And I don't let it happen. That's that's all it is. What I won't do is look to the if I'm on stage at 7:30, I won't look until 7:30. So as they introduce me, your medium tonight is Charlie. And then applauds, yes, and then I go, okay, are we ready? And they go, yes, and then I look.

Charlie Kelly Medium 44:27

Yes, uh and it's very, very clever what you do, and you can tell it's from years and years of doing it, but I'm gonna try that because you know people are overcomplicating it, they really are.

Trust, Doubt & Letting Go of Control

Jason Paul 44:41

It's uh it's unbelievable how much people overcomplicate it. It's unbelievable. I honestly, honestly, I'm not I'm not joking. People are gonna scoff and they'll be like, this guy's full of shit. It's harder to go and make a cup of tea than it is to do a link. I've I've got to get out of the chair, I've got to go, I've got to turn the kettle on, wait, I've got to make the tea, I've got to walk to the fridge, get the milk, then come back and make the tea. And the whole time, when I make a link, if I was to make a link here, I sit here, I don't move, right, Charlie, get in your crate. No one cares, no one wants your opinion, no one needs you to understand. So I've just got to sit and shut up like a good child. And right, what am I saying? And this is what I'm seeing, feeling, sensing, knowing, and I just talk. And then I get a lot of people going, yeah, yeah, and I'm like, Cool, cool, now what? And then I say it again, cool, now what? That's all I do, then it finishes, then I want to get out. I want to go home.

Charlie Kelly Medium 45:44

Do you feel that this layering structured approach that you do, the spirit world or aware for that is how you work, so that is what they are bringing to you in that way, because it's structured.

Jason Paul 45:54

Yeah, I th I think anything's relationship-based, though, isn't it? So I I've lived in this house now for about four years. Is it four years, Carol? Three years. I've been in there three years. Now there I don't know how it happened, but that every other Wednesday, I I got a job of taking the bins down to the fucking curb. And I we never discussed this. It it I don't know how I ended up with that responsibility of taking the bins down. But now apparently it's my job. And that's because it's like the bag of a brown paper bag gets left on the side, and that's got to go in the compost bin, you know. And I know that when I see that bag, I need to go and put that in the bin because if I don't go and put it in the bin, it doesn't go in the bin. And so it's just that relationship that's developed over time. As one example, you'll have a million examples with you, your partner, you, your, you know, the viewers and their the people that live in their homes and you know, or at work. It's just unspoken contracts were built through behavioural patterns, and that is the relationship I've built with the spirit world. I know, and I speak a lot about the intelligence of the spirit world. Why wouldn't they bring it structured? Why wouldn't they bring it layered? Why wouldn't they say the things that you need to know and hear about? Why wouldn't they? And so that the answer there, I can save everyone a long time thinking about it. You're the problem. And I don't like that. I don't like being the problem. So I'm gonna do everything I can to not be the problem, which means Charlie, ego, get in your crate. You're at work now, you're not allowed to play up, you can play out later, and then I finish my dam, I finish my reads, I finish my teaching, and everything winds down, and then I'm an idiot. I'm I allow the ego out the out the crate. You're allowed to go be a fool, go be an idiot, go wind Carol up as much as you can. How does one learn to put the ego in the crates? Because the ego's the the battle, isn't it? So I I don't like the battle. I I can tell you when it happened as well. I remember the day where I was. I I was stood in a shop, and there was, I don't know, eight, nine, ten people in a queue. And I was in I was in some little back village somewhere, and and the woman went, hi you, John, how's how's Jeanette getting on? And and he's like, Yeah, she had the doctors, and and he leant on the counter, and I'm like, person seven. And so I was like, mate, I'm not being rude, but I'm in a rush. So, like, by all means, stop and have your conversation there, but please serve the people that are that are waiting. And and I because it was just whirling round in my mind, like, say something, say something, say something, say something. So he weren't bothered. The woman that he was talking to, she was bothered. I got the face, I got the look, but she served people, and the person behind me went, thanks for that. And I went home and I was like, I'm so glad I didn't come home and say to girl, I should have said this, I should have done that, I should have. And then I was going through Tesco and there was that this couple talking to a couple Saturday morning in the doorway with trolleys. I said to him, mate, I don't, I just don't get people. So can you explain to me what on earth your thought process was to stand in the supermarket doorway on the busiest day of the week and you think you're not in the way? Can you just tell me what your thought process is? Because that I the toothpaste style will be empty. Why don't you have your conversation up there? And I felt good for it. I it like it, I wasn't arguing with myself. Like, I should have said something, I should have done something, I should have been, you know, I should have spoken up, I should have highlighted something. Anyway, I do my weekly shop and I get to the toothpaste style when these four people are stood there and and and I said to them, Have you bothered anyone here? And they were like, No. And I was like, I weren't being rude, it's just like now you can have your conversation and no one's being held up or being put in an awkward position. And he went, No, no, I totally get it, mate. And I just said to myself, at that point, I'm not having that annoying voice in my head go off all night, every night. I'm not doing it anymore. And so whenever it went off, I just spoke my truth. Yeah, and and the ego just the ego just kind of like backed off. Now, I'm an idiot. If I'm fishing and I do the perfect cast, I'm telling Carol I'm the greatest in the world. Oh my god, you're gonna be able to do it. And then she's telling you for it to get back in the cage. Yeah, and she's like, Oh, Charlie's here, is he? Charlie's back.

Charlie Kelly Medium 50:40

So I bet that winds you up, then that all of a sudden the abs is going up.

Jason Paul 50:45

It's the banter, isn't it? It's the banter, but it you've just got to treat it like it's your like a pet dog. They need walking, it needs nurturing, it needs it needs discipline, and your ego needs all of those things, so it needs to come out. No point denying it's there, you've got one, no point denying it, but it's it's got to be under control. Let it like let it out after your dems and your eaves.

Charlie Kelly Medium 51:07

I'm becoming much more aware of it and the unhelpfulness of it and how it means shut the bloody hell up at times. Absolutely. Uh so I want to ask in the time we have remaining, so I love what you're saying about switching on, simplicity of it, being there, on demand, not caring. What should I be doing to develop myself then in this? Because at the moment I'm sitting down, like many of us are trying to, you know, so trying, bloody word trying. Sitting there to feel spirit, sit in the power, whatever you want to call it. What do you feel we should be doing that is uh developing us?

Final Thoughts & What This Means For You

Jason Paul 51:52

What what have we learned? As as part of that team dynamic, like what should people be doing to become better instruments, you mean? Yes, yes, I'm charging. I I think I think what people are doing is like as a as a real generic, so you understand the the line or the train of thought that I'm trying to put you onto is that as that paper bag goes into recycling is an unspoken contract. It's like I learned through behavioural patterns that it's my job to walk that down to the end of the road. And now it's just it's set in stone now. Now the bag gets left on the same spot, and I go end it in the bin. And what mediums are doing is they're they're teaching their team on what they are prepared to do and what they're not prepared to do. They're teaching them all the time. Now, what will happen is as a very generic one, they'll say things like uh like if we spoke it through, and you would say to me, uh, with your person, Charlie, I know I need to talk about hospital appointments. And I'll say to you, How did you get that? And you would say, I saw a nurse. And I would say to you, then why didn't you say nurse? And you would say, Well, I assume it was about Well, I would Well, yes, I would say that.

Charlie Kelly Medium 53:09

And that's probably how it comes across a lot of the time with my mediumship at the moment. I'm sort of getting that, goes up to the brain, tries to bloody interpret it.

Jason Paul 53:15

Exactly. But then I'd then on on a second breath, you'll be like, Right, I'm I'm seeing what he does in his spare time. And I I I think this guy liked fishing. And I would say to you, What made you say that? And you'd go, because I saw Walter. I'd say, Well, why didn't you say Walter? And so what you're doing in that moment in the relationship is you're teaching the spirit world, if you give me water, I'm gonna say fishing. If you give me nurse, I'm gonna say hospital appointment. It's it's very true, isn't it? And and then, and then in the second breath, after you're then, when it's gone a little bit wrong, you'll go home and you'll be like, What are you not doing? Why why don't you just give me the thing you want me to say? And I just imagine the spirit world going, we do give you the thing we want you to say, but you keep changing it. So you'll see a bar stall and you'll say, This man liked drinking. And that's not correct. But but yeah, the the client will go, oh no, oh no. But I bet you if you went, well, actually, you show me a bar stall, oh a bar stall, then yeah, absolutely, I know exactly what you're talking about.

Charlie Kelly Medium 54:27

And that is happening at times because I'm trying to play, and it's this is the the it's learning to get out the way.

Jason Paul 54:35

Exactly, but but but but the difference between a beginner, an intermediate, and a professional is a beginner would go, man, bastal, nurse, walter, and and and then intermediate, they've watched a few TV shows, they've read a few books, they've been on a course at the Arthur Finlay, and that and they'll say, and now the gentleman's making me aware of the hospital appointments he had. Then I know that he liked and spent the weekends doing fishing. Same thing, the nurse, the water, the bastard. And I know this man liked to drink. No, so beginner is bland, nothing, no showmanship, no presentation, but then you're learning that it needs to sound a little bit better. So you start embellishing, you start adding a word or two here and there, and it goes wrong. Now, now, oh my god, what's happening? I've got to fix it all. And then the professional will say the thing that they're receiving exactly as they are, but they'll make it sound different. So now with mum, she's making me aware of the nurse that I need to talk about. And and the client will go, oh, she was lovely, that nurse. She was lovely. And now she draws my attention to this, this, this place, this body of water. Oh my god, I love that place. We went there as kids. Now, what happens at that point is that client goes away and tells everyone, I told them about the holiday where they went away as a kid. And I told them about the nursing coming into the home. I didn't. The power of the word is in the nurse, and I say nurse, and the power ignites the memory. Now the client goes on memory, and you'll have that yourself. You'll hear a song and you'll be teleported back in time to that time when life was great, and it would be the first beat of that song, and you are reliving memories in layered form. And so, as I talk about the nurse, yes, the next layer would come in. I see your home. Oh, yeah, she she came around the house quite a lot. Now she's talking about, and I'm saying exactly what I'm given. Exactly. I don't embellish it, I don't leave anything out, I say exactly what I got, and my hit weight, hit rate went through the roof. And it's and what what I learned was I don't know who you are, I don't know who they are, and I'm trying to make the story sound good for Charlie. What an idiot.

Charlie Kelly Medium 57:10

You're such a good teacher because you keep it so real and tell you this in the realest way possible. I I think to myself, if you were a car and it was a speedometer, how many readings have you done now to acquire this way of working and seeing it? Like so many.

Jason Paul 57:24

I would hate to count them up. I know, I know I did do the Dems, I counted up the Dems. I've done over three and a half thousand public dems now. I did count them up because and and that's with Carol's record, so it's like it's a lot of Dems. I've done a lot of Dems, yeah. So that readings, I said I'm I'd be scared to count up the hours locked in a room on a monitor or with a little recording unit, you know, it's terrifying, terrifying.

Charlie Kelly Medium 57:54

It's it's just fascinating, and I think it, you know, it it's really helped me this hour as well. Because you know, I would say I'm in that place at the moment. When you described it, it was making me laugh there. Because I think I'm in between intermediate and advance, yeah. Because I'm I'm starting to understand it is coming to me. I'm starting to realize that I am the problem here. Get the hell out of the way. But I've I've probably got elements of the showmanship. This is what I said last night, Charlie, even when I did my deb. I said, I probably didn't give the best evidence, but I certainly was the best showman.

Jason Paul 58:28

Yeah, absolutely, absolutely. And some people need training for showmen, whereas you'll do it naturally. So where people would fall behind in development, you would be leaps and bounds ahead. Yeah. And so where people and vice versa, isn't it? And so I I see it very much like children, you know. Like I I I grew up with my kids, and and my my daughter was walking like down the shop with me at 10 months, and and her cousin wasn't walking until two and a half years old. But they were exactly the same when they went to primary school. They were on everything was all caught up and they were all at the same at the same level. And I think there is a a transition of of like puberty in the human, where you go from like annoying, young male to then adulthood and responsibilities, and there's this skip in maturity. You know, you shouldn't be filling your belly with chocolate when the partner's been cooking all day or roasting or whatever. You're grown up enough to go, I want the chocolate, but I shouldn't have it. Dinner's on its way. As a kid, you're like, I'll eat the chocolate and the dinner, and and you ruin it.

Charlie Kelly Medium 59:42

Well, yeah, some people age like a fine wine and others like a sort of curry that's been out on the side for too long. I'd like to think I'm sort of coming into the fine wine territory. It's probably a bit like a smelly old Stilton at times, but that's still valuable too, Charlie.

Jason Paul 59:56

I think it is, I think it is, and and I just think there is this shift in maturity in mediumship where you go, get over yourself, get out of the way. It's not about you, indeed.

Charlie Kelly Medium 1:00:06

Well, I think the message of today, it really is get out the way. It really is, and stop caring as well.

Jason Paul 1:00:14

Yeah, well, you can invest in yourself, yeah, absolutely.

Charlie Kelly Medium 1:00:18

Yes. So go on then. It's been a blast, Charlie Kelly. It's lovely to see you. If you want to also, your last episode was really good, so take a listen to that. Charlie's YouTube link will be in the description. Do us the honour of a final thought today, Charlie.

Jason Paul 1:00:32

A final thought today. I think we've covered on everything that we've been doing there. I think if you really want to excel, and it's probably mediums or developing mediums that are watching a podcast or listening to a podcast like this, I I would really try and let go of what you think mediumship is. Because you you will hear my advice or or ways of doing stuff, and you'll try and squeeze that into your way of working. And it took me 15 years to realise that those ways don't work in my way of working, so I had to kind of loosen the parameters up. So just just kind of go into mediumship as naively as you did in the beginning without the pressures on self, and you will enjoy it more, you'll see what I'm talking about, so you'll love the work a lot more, and it will just reignite that flame.

Charlie Kelly Medium 1:01:24

So there's something really in that because the first ever reading I did on the platform, the first ever time, I just walked up there, didn't give a crap, didn't even realise what I was doing the first time I went on one of these courses. It was one of the best readings. I spent three years, I still couldn't do one better than that.

Jason Paul 1:01:40

Yeah, yeah. Expectation, point in case. Yeah, yeah. Expectation, parameters, you know. So you're trying to replicate, so just enjoy it. Too many people, I see too many people stressing about the thing that I love most in the world, you know. So, like, enjoy it, love it.

Charlie Kelly Medium 1:01:57

Well, thank you for coming onto the SoulSync. It's been lovely.

Jason Paul 1:02:01

My pleasure.